The Big Noob

I do think Jin is dead, just not in that grave. I have a suspicion that he somehow died in the process of getting his wife and unborn child off of the island. He made it a point to say that he would do anything for them. I might be way off base here but Sun just didn't seem like she had much hope. I can't believe that he is alive…. but then again she was calling his name during the delivery. I can see a scene where Jin is telling Sun that she must leave the island and not look back.

I am still hung up on Charles Widmore. If he is such a bad guy and an enemy of Ben's; why wouldn't Ben be more interested in Desmond. I haven't even heard Ben say his name. Does he not know who he is? He has to know who he is. They had that camera in the Swan Hatch. I can't believe that Ben wouldn't do his research on him. Does that mean Ben is really working with Charles and just manipulating Locke? Will Ben always take Locke to school or will he wise up?

Is it me or were there 3 dates on Jin's tomb? Was one of the those, Sun's birthdates?

Just a thought … but if the Time Loop Theory is correct, then fate will have course corrected Jin to being dead since he's had a complete change of character.

TLT isn't truth … it has huge flaws, just trying to get the gears turning.

Deep down I want Jin to be alive, sipping Dharma Piña Coladas back on the island.

Also, can Michael be trusted? The captain seems to be playing the honest card, but we were warned (possibly by Michael) that the captain can't be trusted. We all know that Ben can rarely be trusted … and his minions are even more untrustworthy. So, can Michael really be trusted … if he truly is Ben's "man on the boat"?

(PS: The British have it correct … punctuation on the outside of quotes.)

@Nick: Yep. I'm completely up in the air on the Widmore/Linus soap opera. Who's bad? Who's good? At least there is comfort in knowing that we'll have the truth by May of 2010.

@Rene: Hmm. It's worth looking into.

@Adam: I guess if the whole chat on the boat about karma has any real place in the story, then maybe Jin has bid us adieu. He wasn't the nicest of guys pre-island life. :) Dammit.

Well, it seems as though Jin is back under the thumb of Mr. Paik, and his life is apart from Sun. My instincts tell me that he has been forced to lead another life by Mr. Paik, who has involvement with Widmore and the cover-up.

When Sun and Hurley visited his grave, they truly seemed believe he was dead. Something sinister has yet to happen where the Oceanic Six believe that he has died, or that he was left behind, and his death in the crash of Flight 815 is part of their cover-up story.

What is unknown is how he gets off the island separate from the others. Fishy.

And of course, Michael is back. But where's Walt?

Well well…….how many people are the Oceanic Six, finally: Jack, Hurley, Kate, Aaron, Sun, Sayid…….thats all?

What if the dead guy on LA was Jin? lol So, what if the Jin panda story was a flashback???

The captain looks very smart guy, but the Ben situation makes all this so tricky yet..

The girl who jumps to the ocean………..amazing!

Wow, just WOW. I feel like I've been worked over like a high priced hooker in a Washington DC luxury suite. The LOST writers, have made the perfect formula on how to get my emotions in a bunch. Michaels back? He's the spy, how far is Ben reach? He made 325 dead people appear in some fake plane recovery. HOW WILL THIS ALL END? Hats off Mr. Abrams, may I rue the day I made fun of a show like Felicity. My God, there will be blood to pay.

Well, I was going to watch the episode tonight. Maybe you can put a [5P01L3R]-tag in the title next time…

@Brad, http://img181.imageshack.us/img181/3761/tombstoneho7.jpg

@ Rene: Yes, that is Sun's birthday on the left side of the tombstone. It's a common practice for married couples to have their name and birthdate on the tombstone after their loved one dies. It just shows that they're going to be buried next to them, and they will share the same tombstone.

@Andrew: I really just thought that this episode was a flash forward for Sun and a flash back for Jin. That's why he said he'd only been married two months, and it would also explain why he was able to yell about ripping someone's head off. I could be wrong, though!

Thank you Lostpedia for confirming some of my thoughts:

- Jin's flashes were a flashback. The shop owner said it's the year of the dragon, which was 2000. Jin's cellphone was also pretty bulky and Y2Kish.

- Jin's tombstone has the date of the crash. That leads me to believe that he may still be alive on the island.

My theories (which will probably be all wrong)?

Jin is alive, but the Oceanic 6 (minus Jack and maybe Sayid) ) think that everyone on the island is dead. Somehow the Oceanic 6 get off the island via rescue mission, but only 6 people could go. They are then told that everyone who stayed on the island died/were killed/etc. Jack gets a little crazy (hopped up on painkillers) and starts doing a lot of research about the island and the Dharma project and somehow finds out that everyone is still alive on the island ("We've got to go back Kate!"). As of right now, I predict we will see Jin and Sun reunited in a later season.

Total OH SHI- moments in Ji Yeon? 0.5 The moment I realized Jin was having flash-backs I just said "oh."

Disregard. Everything.

I really do wonder if Michael pulled a Desmond maneuver for reals and ended up back in the past, totally unaware of any plane crash, Walt, or his betrayal of the crash survivors. OR, I wonder if he actually sent him to his death at sea, and this "Kevin Johnson" is Michael in some alternate lifestream?

But something tells me that Michael is fully aware of his past: the crash, his betrayal, and the people he murdered, and is Ben's spy/saboteur on the boat. I hope Sayid and Desmond orchestrate an operatic beatdown on that dude next week.

That should have been "OR, I wonder if BEN actually sent him to his death at sea, and this "Kevin Johnson" is Michael in some alternate lifestream?"

I get all giddy thinking about LOST.

Man, I gotta catch up on the past two weeks of LOST. You have no idea how hard it is for me not to read this post or it's comments. *la la la desmond la la*

@Matt, thanks. I wasn't aware of that. I thought maybe it meant that's where Sun and Jin's fake bodies were buried. *shrug*

Wow, Season 4 already had some of the best episodes of the whole show. And what a mindf*ck this episode was with the mixed flashback and flashforward. I don't think Jin is still alive on the island

This was an absolutely awesome episode. Not as good as The Constant IMHO, but still pretty damn great.

Last night did win points on the creepiness factor. The crew on the freighter, the woman jumping to her death, the quarters for Des and Sayid…

This episode was such a tease. They devoted a good part of the episode to tricking us into thinking Jin was alive, only to make us cry even harder at the end… there was no other purpose whatsoever to the 5+ minutes they devoted to Jin getting that panda other than to play games with us! How insensitive. I just hope next week they return to giving us answers instead of tricking us and making us cry.

Oh and Jin is totally still alive… I think Patrick got it right… the Oceanic 6 think that everyone that "stayed" on the island is dead (except Jack and Sayid)… the grave is a set-up… they produced all those bodies at the bottom of the ocean somehow… so maybe the body in that grave is the one they "found" at the bottom of the ocean, since the date on the tombstone was the date of the crash…

I don't know what's up regarding the time line on Michael and Walt, but I think Ben took Walt again, and is using Michael as an asset. Ben is a master manipulator and strategist, and knows that Walt is Michael's ultimate vulnerability. It is not difficult to exploit someone once you have discovered a true weakness of theirs. This is especially true for an uber intelligent super spy like Ben (the guy has 50 passports).

In other words, Ben kidnapped Walt and now OWNS Michael. Michael was, is, and always will be a bitch.

@Jacques… I think you've got it right. That would semi explain Walt showing up when Locke was shot in the Dharma grave stew…

I don't think there's any way Michael could have been caught up in the flash-back mess Desmond's in. He would have died by now… (Unless he had Walt as his constant.) Also, he wouldn't recognize Sayid and Des.

I had been guessing it was Michael for a while so it was cool to see him in the little easter egg shot. When the girl jumps off the boat and everyone is looking overboard you get a glimpse of a hooded Michael leaning over a shoulder.

How sketchy is their room with the blood stains?

ok this was an ok episode, given that the last 2 have been flat out amazing. But here are some things that I thought about while watching: 1) does anyone know morse code? Go back and listen to the clanking sound that Des thought was engine trouble, and 2) Remember that Walt was being tested for a "uniqueness" while captured by the Others? Walt has some sort of ability that allows him to appear to people, he did it to Micheal (I think), Locke, & Shannon all while either captured or supposedly off the island. Like I said, these are just things I thought of while watching, figured I'd fan the fire a bit.

sayid is working for ben. i don't think he is a part of the oceanic 6. i think he gets off the island via ben.

Jin got busted for DUI lol Jin and Juice! – so of course he was gonna be dead. They kill of anybody gets into dookie (trouble) with the popo (police)